I was talking to a guy this weekend that owns a Kratom bar locally. He was talkin to me about his source and was telling me it's hydroponically grown and that the quality is superb. Which got me to thinking. If it takes 4 or 5 years before the plant is producing the proper alkaloids how can they possibly be hydroponically growing trees of that size? Or is there a way to produce what we want in shorter periods of time and on smaller plants
I was talking to a guy this we
I would question if that kava bar owner is really sustaining his operation with hydroponically grown kratom. A lot of the kratom vendors believe they are getting certain things when they’re being lied to. Take strains for example - all made up for marketing. You often hear vendors make claims about their leaves harvested from the wild etc, but most really have no control over leaf sourcing and Indonesian suppliers will tell them what they want to hear. Do you know if his source is Indonesian? Was he offering powder or crushed leaf?
On another note , unless there is science out there that shows trees cannot develop the alkaloids til an older age; I think the farmers and growers of kratom may be attaching on to a consensus theory when in reality, some young leaves could be potent. I think Older trees will give you a greater odds at harvesting potent leaves, but it’s not impossible for young plants to have potent leaves if they’re healthy strong and getting the nutrients. If a young tree has some dark green, dense and thick leaves, those leaves will probably be potent is what I think. It’s possible that with hydro you could have young trees that are rich in alkaloids. Are you able to share what kava bar this was? I definitely want to look into it. If he really is getting hydro, that sounds pretty awesome.
Couple of blog posts from Magick powers potions debunking the theory that young trees don’t have mitra (warning their site is annoyingly slow).
https://www.magickpowerspotions.com/post/kratom-harvest-maturity
https://www.magickpowerspotions.com/post/2-0-mitragynine-in-new-american-kratom-line
I do think that a hydro grower could grow quality Kratom, but I question whether they could provide quantity.
@Andrew-Goldin I'll do my best to dig a little deeper and answer some of those questions. As far as the younger trees go, I have two that are 7ft tall and 2 years old and several that are 5 foot in about a year old and have yet to harvest anything viable off of them and I sure want them to produce something. They are healthy and robust
I went to the guys kava bar this morning to see his set up. Nice place tried his Green strain tea that was also very nice. More about his hydroponic supplier. he said it's all coming out of Dubai. He had pictures of the operation but that was some time ago and can't find them he's going to have the guy send him some more. But he said the place is a size of a super Walmart with clean rooms lighting everything you could possibly imagine he said it's unimaginable. The product he has, based on first impression, is better than anything I'm currently getting. Granted I've only tried one strain, so we will see. Hopefully he will get some pictures and I can post them here
I didn’t think it was even legal there. Would love to try some hydro leaf, is the bar in the Tampa/St Pete area?
@roadkill what’s the name of the bar? No reason to keep it secret, I’m sure their customers are sharing the name. I’d like to try it. I am a bit skeptical about his claims of it coming from Dubai. The real estate is insanely expensive there. Did the warehouse pics you saw clearly show kratom plants? I’m reading the United Arab Emirates prohibited kratom a few years ago.
@roadkill said:
<p>I was talking to a guy this weekend that owns a Kratom bar locally. He was talkin to me about his source and was telling me it's hydroponically grown and that the quality is superb. Which got me to thinking. If it takes 4 or 5 years before the plant is producing the proper alkaloids how can they possibly be hydroponically growing trees of that size? Or is there a way to produce what we want in shorter periods of time and on smaller plants</p>
I just saw an ad for wholesale at $ 10/kg 10,000 kg min. Hard to believe hydro can be done cheaper.
@Andrew-Goldin no I haven't seen the pictures yet he told me he had some on his phone couldn't find them but was going to get the guy to send him some more. We'll see. Place is called Vapor Bay and it's in Brandon it's not a large place but it's nice even has a pool table
thanks! Already contacted them, gonna get 50g and see how it is. I googled hydroponic farm Dubai, and there are a lot of huge hydro farms. I think this guy might be telling the truth. I’m intrigued!
@Andrew-Goldin damn I would be interested in how it is. Please let us know how it goes.
@Andrew-Goldin I happen to go by there this morning to get some more product and he had said you called I guess he figured out that I was the one that told you about it. Anyway nice guy seems to know what he's talking about. Good luck. So far I'm happy to find a new source now as long as it stays consistent I'll be super happy
So I just got the kratom from your guy in the mail. But off the bat I feel pretty strongly that this is not hydro based off the smell and flavor. I’ll explain how I came to that conclusion.
In Indonesia many of the grinding machines are old and gas powered. You can find a lot of posts online about kratom having a gassy/Smokey flavor. It’s quite common. Some ppl have tried to defend the sanctity of kratom by saying the gassy smell is caused by forest fires. But This smell is actually caused by the old grinding machines, sometimes they can jam up and cause smoke, or for all I know sometimes gas can somehow get in. There are even posts online of sharp metal in kratom, sometimes as small as dust bc the machines are so old and delapidated. You can read about both on Reddit. Not the machines, but the metal and the gassy odor. People don’t seem to know why it happens; but it’s from shitty old machinery.
Immediately when I smelled the hydro kratom I smelled a gassy flavor and tasted it too. This led me to believe that this kratom comes from Indonesia, bc i think a hydroponic farm in Dubai would likely have new equipment. Sometimes the gassy kratom can be potent because the farmers are often times the ones using old equipment. In Indonesia you have farmers, but there are the guys who just process powder and export and those guys have much better machinery than farmers, but they don’t get fresh leaf like a farmer does. I make my farmer bring his leaves to another guy to process them, bc his machine is old and crappy. By the way I’m a vendor / importer and also a daily kratom user. I was actually hoping this guys stuff was better than mine. I’m always looking to level up. I tend to evaluate quality off color, taste, freshness, when those criteria are met potency is usually there. I don’t go strictly off potency bc I think it allows for low manufacturing standards. For example, any indonesian can dry a potent leaf on the ground, animals can walk on it; then it’s ground in a crappy old machine, but some users will think it’s fire bc it gave them good effects. The practices in Indonesia are pretty filthy and if ppl saw it, cleanliness would be the biggest concern.
I am happy to send you a free sample of crisp, it’s my new brand and it’s just one strain of the highest grade super green. All I take myself is Crisp. I believe it’s the freshest cleanest and highest grade kratom on the market.
I don’t mean to put your guys operation down and feel kinda bad, but when they advertise hydro from Dubai I’m going to give my full professional opinion. This whole gassy odor thing is the reason I changed from my first supplier about 3.5 years ago.
@Andrew-Goldin excellent I appreciate all the information. I am always looking to level up myself and have been searching for quality products for quite some time. Just never really found true and very knowledgeable source. You definitely sound like you know your shit and greatly appreciate the information. I would definitely like to try your crisp I will p.m. you with address info.
I spent a bunch of time searching and looking at YouTube videos of farmers and their methodology. So I am fully aware of the cleanliness of many of their operations. Surprisingly it doesn't stop me I still take it. But knowing I have a better source for Quality I will jump on it in a heartbeat. I am all about the quality.
now that I'm growing it I just got to figure out what it is I have to do to ensure I get a good product
Yes!!!! Thank you so much for speaking up about this. I’m REALLY concerned about the way we are spreading so much misinformation. I grow Kratom myself and it blows my mind how incredibly ignorant our people are or misinformed from being lied to. It actually breaks my heart because I have thousands of friends who are Kratom advocates and consumers who want to grow but don’t because of ppl telling them the leaves don’t produce alkaloids that are potent or that our soil is bad OR that it’s impossible to grow it here bc of our climate. All of that is a myth/misconception. I have eaten my leaves in raw form and they are very potent. My trees are at least 4 years old. I live in Cali and my plants are THRIVING. During the winter I place them in a greenhouse. The guy I bought them from lives in Georgia and he says the same thing as me. They are potent at 4 years of age. I haven’t tried any younger than that. But, guys please find out for yourself if you grow. And if you don’t grow, don’t be discouraged by what other ppl r telling you bc it’s all lies. I was in pretty bad pain at like a ‘6’. I ate a leaf and within minutes my pain was gone.
https://southeastbeautifulkratom.com/growing-kratom-in-america/
@Andrew-Goldin checking to see if you got the chat message I sent you. Apparently the chat is screwed up I'd like to send you my contact information so I can test some crisp
@Andrew-Goldin oh my, that's beautiful. My usual dose is about 5g if it's all that do you recommend I stay with that or reduce that. And it's just straight plant correct no additives.
Hey @Glenn-Manning I am one of the owners of the #kratomapp.
We offer 3 for 1 on unrooted cuttings here
https://kratomleaf.us/product/...
We also have older American Kratom seed pods available here
https://kratomleaf.us/product/...
And we also make the fresh leaf available from our American Kratom trees.
I was reading one of your comments and seen that you are talking about crisp, is there anyway I could get a sample of that I've been looking for a decent place but I'm new to all of this so I haven't gotten very far
so happy to read so much success and attempting success in so many places! Very inspiring for the long term USA sourced kratom! 🙏
I look forward to hearing about the difference y’all may notice. I would interrupt and embarrass myself by asking to try it as well, but I don’t possess the clear senses needed to smell and taste those differences. I absolutely do agree about the farmers and clean drying issues as well as old grinders. Not a fan of the brokers/processors and their random “cold call” sales, no matter how courteous. But I’m glad to know they are doing quite a lot more than buying from the farmer (or not acquiring product at all) and then posting online. I’m interested in where Indonesian individuals shop for massive quantity capable grinding equipment. Thank you for sharing the discussion. When I do notice unique smells and flavors, now I have something to sort of consider. Very helpful! Loving this app/forum for learning more stuff like this! Dubai having good resource and processing is VERY ENCOURAGING to know. 👍